I’m guessing this is the real crux of the problem. They’re trying to sell to some of the most glacial organizations on planet.
The bigger the organization, the slower it moves. Purchasing cycles can take anywhere from 6 months to YEARS if you’re talking big business or government.
This is also why B2B and B2G are such lucrative markets to be in.
Having a bunch of lazy, stumbling giants with basically unlimited money as your clients is the holy grail. Once they’ve been sold, they literally CANNOT stop buying from you if even they wanted to. It’d be a year before they could even get another supplier approved! Talk about low churn.
I think they are just bad at sales.
We have government and hospital contracts. But, we are really good at sales. My team is really good at sales. Previously, My President and head of sales ran a medical sales division at a company with 300 sales people. We have about 17 sales folks. And we wouldn't be thriving without that team.
They also might not be great at manufacturing.
There stuff is really expensive. They are selling an ASTM Level 3 mask for $37.5 + $8 Shipping! That's $0.90 a mask delivered.
https://shop.demetech.us/collections/surgical-mask-astm-leve...
I can buy a Chinese made ASTM Level 3 masks delivered for $0.18 FROM CHINA.
How can they win charging 5 times more? Because "America"? That argument is many a 3x multiple :)
If I were to guess by looking at all their photos, it looks they have a very manual process for making masks and packing masks. We've had to semi automate the packaging process to survive (which no one else has done). When we fully automated it later this year we will be able to sell our masks much much cheaper than China can.
Our masks sell between $0.20 - $0.59 which is still too high, but all of our margins go directly into investing in the product.
"If we do not get approval, you will get your money back. You can also cancel at any time."
What does this mean? Are they sold out or are they waiting on government approval? Not very confidence inspiring.
Is not shipping from China to the US a big part of the cost savings ?
That is in some ways true. However, the ability to manage a complex sales process is a good proxy for ability to manage customer stakeholders and do the project planning and management required for success.
eg if you can't manage a complex sales process, the probability a vendor is mature enough to ship eg 2mm masks/month on time, with appropriate quality levels, and with the resources to manage production disruptions is quite low. And that's what hospital systems want to buy.
> “How is it that you can spread conspiracy theories on Facebook, but we can’t sell N95 masks to the millions of Americans who need them right now?” Mr. Brown asked. “I can understand Facebook not wanting to sell masks made by some guy in his garage, but these masks meet strict N.I.O.S.H. guidelines.”
I can more understand the first half of the article, about ingrained purchasing processes in hospitals etc. leaving newcomers with unbought supply, but this is nuts. All the crap that Amazon does show if you search 'mask' or 'respirator' over the last year, and they refuse to list genuine stuff?
I still have a disposable FFP3 (UK/EU N99 equivalent I believe) from a couple of years before the pandemic, it was £1.12ea or much less in packs. Currently I'd have to pay 10x that for a shitty piece of ill-fitting cloth. (It's probably technically past its shelf life, but it can't be worse than fabric that never met any filtration specification.)
That said, was I aware of these smaller USA n95 sellers, I might have purchased from them. But at slightly less than $1/mask delivered for these KN95s, it's still a good choice.
EDIT: Note the N95 / KN95 difference: N95 is the US standard, KN95 is the China standard.
That’s the practice known as “Daigou” (代购): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daigou
A pre-pandemic article about the practice, specifically in Australia: “The daigou channel — how a handful of Chinese shoppers turned into a billion-dollar industry” (2019-07-31) https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-07-31/chinese-daigou-changi...
Any source for that?
From what I've seen, N95, KN95, FFP2 and others are pretty much equivalent. There are some small differences but none that significantly affect the level of protection. There are certainly differences between manufacturers, and maybe there are more fake KN95 than there are fake N95, but that's not an issue with the certification.
I wish N95’s did not necessitate the second strap, but hey, it’s better than COVID!
[0] https://shop.demetech.us/collections/n95-respirator-masks/pr...
Edit: for the record, I think the ones I got at Home Depot are nicer. They have a foam cushion on the bridge of the nose and a super sturdy “pinch”.
Learn which hospitals are struggling with masks. Lease a bunch of U-Haul/Ryder trucks and fill them with masks. Park them in front of the hospitals with massive banners on the side: “50,000 made in USA n95 masks inside. Call 555-555-5555”
Pretty soon you’ll be selling every mask you make.
Or start selling direct to consumer using marketplaces like Amazon.
Like getting a piece in the nytimes?
> Or start selling direct to consumer using marketplaces like Amazon.
Per the article, most consumer destinations ban any mask advertising because of scalping.
Back in my day we called that a slashvertisement.
This is glorious.
https://abcnews.go.com/2020/Stossel/story?id=1954352
Shepperson thought he could help and make some money, too, so he bought 19 generators. He and his family then rented a U-Haul and drove 600 miles to an area of Mississippi that was left without power in the wake of the hurricane.
He offered to sell his generators for twice what he had paid for them, and people were eager to buy. Police confiscated his generators, though, and Shepperson was jailed for four days for price-gouging. His generators are still in police custody.
Here in Germany (we need surgical masks or (K)N95/FFP2 masks to go to the store or for public transport) they have been available easily for a while. Prices for Made in Germany ones were (and are) high, but getting Chinese-made masks shipped from EU or German warehouses was easy, and now one of our discounters (Lidl) started selling them for 0.88€ ($1.07) per piece.
I bought 20 FFP2 and 50 surgical masks in a pack from a German medical equipment importer for 25€ ($30).
It works like this: You basically rent a bit of shelf space in a warehouse somewhere in the USA and get your personal shipping address in that warehouse. Your unique address is identified by a unique "suite number" in the mailing address. You have stores send your packages there and the freight forwarder optionally holds them for some time, usually up to 30 days. Then you can consolidate the individual packages and have them sent as one shipment. I'm using MyUS these days; They ship by weight only, and have very fair shipping rates. I have been able to ship non-medical N95-level masks through MyUS.
Having access to in-USA shipping makes quite a big difference. You get access to a big consumer market, which makes the unbuyable buyable and the hard-to-buy easy!
What the hell's gone wrong with the US? (If this were the early/mid 1940s then the AXIS powers would have won!)
In their desire to wield censorship to avoid bad PR, these companies are actually hindering some of the people doing the best work (and taking on their own financial risk!) to help. This is despicable.
Why are large corporations so cowardly?
This isn't a mystery. Public pressure doesn't work because corporations "feel bad".
i.e. wearing a mask will protect a user, but the outside of it isn't sterile. So if you come off a covid ward, easier to just bin the mask and take a new one, than wash the outside of a re-usable one.
Although perhaps that makes more sense in an operating theatre than many of the lower-risk places people now wear them, all day.
[0]: https://static01.nyt.com/images/2021/02/09/science/09VIRUS-M...
https://www.buyfacemasks.co.uk/
No idea how reliable they are, but that's always the danger when you buy anything from a small shop. I don't like the look of is as I can't find any corporate information about the store on their site, but it's no worse than buying anything else online.
I actually didn't know they were even available, after being told by officials to use cloth masks for 10+ months I stopped looking. I was surprised how easy and available they were.
EDIT: As others have pointed out their website is down. It was working as recently as 1 month ago. Sorry!
Your link doesn't work anymore, but KN95-style masks have been quite readily available for at least 6 months now, if not more. Though most of them seem to be of iffy quality/fit in my experience. Sometimes they're marketed at N95, but I'm thinking that's usually fraudulent mislabeling.
"Only one step left! To finish setting up your new web address, go to your domain settings, click "Connect existing domain", and enter: clinicalsuppliesusa.com"
Valves with a diffuser cap that stops the air jetting out are probably the best if you have this restriction.
That being said, I have breathing problems and the combination of masks and cold weather is awful. I'd love to wear something that released the moisture. It wouldn't be nice to the people around me, though, and I can just get away from people to take a break if I need it.
If this is true, these companies are responsible for thousands of deaths, and should be prosecuted.
Early on in the pandemic, around April, selling masks for $7 was considered price gouging [0] and $1.27 was the politically fair price. The tech companies are already facing various government investigations for being greedy capitalists; I can very much see the wisdom of whoever decided to stay away from masks.
I'm watching with interest what happens to these small time mask makers. Their fate will influence the behaviour of people who anticipate the next crisis.
[0] https://theintercept.com/2020/04/01/coronavirus-3m-n95-masks...
Citation? Ther actual written standards of N95 vs KN95 are very similar, and if anything KN95 is probably slightly better. To meet KN95, the mask must be shown not to let air pass around the edges even while doing vigorous exercise, whereas N95 has no such requirement.
This is notable in the shape of N95 and KN95 masks. Some N95 masks look like someone just hit the "circle" button in some CAD software, whereas KN95 masks clearly have effort to actually being human-shaped.
Personally I am using some Chinese made masks every now and then from a reasonably well known company, but they are CE certified FFP2 masks. Still prefer big brands when I can get them though, but they're still ridiculously expensive.
[0] https://assets.ecri.org/PDF/COVID-19-Resource-Center/COVID-N...
In my experience, actual KN95s have extensive leakage, especially around the nose. One factor may be that Western faces and Asian faces are different, and my understanding is that the KN95 standard and masks are tailored to Asian facial structures.
For instance, this is an assessment of a KN95 style mask I actually bought at a Menard's clearance a few months ago. It definitely has fit problems around my nose.
https://www.cdc.gov/niosh/npptl/respirators/testing/results/...
> While the above-listed product classification has similar performance requirements to NIOSH-approved devices, NIOSH does not have knowledge about the sustained manufacturer quality system and product quality control for these products. NIOSH also does not have knowledge about the product’s handling and exposures after leaving its manufacturer’s control.
> In addition, this product is an ear loop design. Currently, there are no NIOSH-approved products with ear loops; NIOSH-approved N95s have head bands. Furthermore,limited assessment of ear loop designs, indicate difficulty achieving a proper fit. While filter efficiency shows how well the filter media performs, users mustensure a proper fit is achieved.
The first batch might...
Given that, I have no issues with using a fake mask. My manual fitting effort to reduce leakage around the mask will have far far more impact on health outcomes than the exact specifications of the way the ear straps go as required by high grade medical certifications...
It's time we de-emphasized product certifications and paperwork in favor of simply getting more products that mostly work into the hands of more people. Per dollar spent, far more people will have improved lives.
You could also buy them cheap on Amazon with no CE labeling or with fake labeling, if you are feeling adventurous.
https://www.protectivemasksdirect.co.uk/
This is a legit store with legit masks, it existed before the pandemic.
In general, if someone is looking for FFP2/FFP3/N95 masks, search for personal protection equipment stores in your country, not Amazon/eBay/...
and then there's people who rage at others for wearing valved masks, even if the valves are properly capped. My wife's had to deal with a few dickheads like that.
I did the same, but I managed to get them before the supply closed off (I have a box of US-made 3M 8210s that has literally been to China and back). I got some KN95s, but only use them when I'd have used an N95 previously (e.g. sanding).
I had no idea about these new US manufacturers, but if their product is NIOSH approved then I think I'd be happy with them.
For example, if the standard says "must reduce particulates by 95%", yet the mask reduces particulates by 94%, then it might be reasonable to fine the importer (6-5)/5 = 20% of the value of the goods.
The key is to try to encourage all products to be as good as possible, without introducing months of delay and tens of thousands of dollars of paperwork for every product.
But masks are widely available in pharmacies and specialized stores. I'd try to find a store selling occupational safety items if I were you.
The citation's from 12 years ago and may no longer be accurate.
What I’ve heard, is that almost all the European labs had crazy backlogs for certification of PPE and the Turkish one was the only one with capacity.
[0] www.universalcert.com
