Ask HN: Best countries for international grad student to bootstrap a startup

8 points by ginger_beer 14 years ago | 12 comments

I'm finishing my master's degree in bioinformatics from the UK now and would continue for a PhD in either CS/bioinfo afterwards. During the PhD, I would also like to try to slowly bootstrap an Internet startup idea that I have in mind (not related to bioinformatics). My question is, which country would allow me to do graduate study while working on bootstrapping the start-up at the same time? For the UK, at least, people on student visa are not allowed to work on their own business during the course of their study, which is why I'm thinking of leaving after the master's. I'd considered the US too but the multi-decades timeframe required to complete the grad study there is quite scary.

Also, my current citizenship is Indonesian, so I could encounter visa restrictions for working in many western countries. Regardless, I hope this questions might be of some relevancy to others who're in the same situation as me.

PS. The matter of finding a suitable advisor in that country can be considered to be outside the scope. Thanks!

md1515 14 years ago |

Multi-decade time frame required to complete grad study? If you have a master's degree already then you only need two more years for a Ph.D (in most cases - or at least both of my parents did and I highly doubt they were both abnormally fast).

Are you solely working on the start-up? I would suggest going about your business without the need to incorporate right away. A lot of people waste a lot of time and money incorporating when they have no idea if the product can be built, is desired in the market place, or validated.

My suggestion would be to come to the U.S for your Ph.D (if visa requirements allow you to do so). You will have two years to work on your studies and then also validate your startup idea in the U.S, which may be more friendly in terms of validation and (if you moved to startup hubs) could be useful in terms of incorporating and scaling.

Whatever you decide to do, best of luck!

ginger_beer 14 years ago | |

The 'multi-decade' bit was just meant to be tongue-in-cheek. I was just implying that it took sooo much longer to complete the PhD in the US, as opposed to Commonwealth countries (UK, and to some extent, Australia, New Zealand). Giving up 7 years of my life is just too much to ask.

Also, when I mention about visa requirement, I mean the restriction on freely moving into a country and expecting to be able to work right away. Studying anywhere in the world is not much of a problem for me, visa-wise.

mzbridget 14 years ago | |

No, he's correct - it can be years longer than the UK for a PhD. avg is 7 years here (5 w/a MA) compared to 3 in the UK. But I agree that he should just go for both and try to make them intersect as much as possible. The data from my business is the backbone of my thesis research.

mzbridget 14 years ago |

I'm curious about the statement you made that the UK uni's won't let you work on a startup during your course of study. I plan to apply for the PhD (as an American in the UK) in personal informatics. I have been very upfront when speaking to advisors in the uni's that it directly relates to my company and no one has mentioned that I can't work on my business and PhD.

Anyway - to answer your question: have you looked at the Eastern European schools? Slovakia, Czech - both countries have wonderful tech uni's.

ginger_beer 14 years ago | |

If you come here on the Tier 4 student visa (as what most people do), you'd face the following restriction:

A student from outside of the EEA must not: • engage in business; or • engage in self-employment; or • provide services as a professional sportsperson or entertainer; or • pursue a career by filling a permanent full-time vacancy.

You can see that from page 71 here: http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/sitecontent/documents/empl...

There used to be a Post Study Visa that gave you the freedom for two years post-study to goof off/work/incorporate/whatnot but unfortunately that had been cancelled last year (just the moment when I enrolled .. sigh). However, there's an entrepreneur visa that an aspiring startup might try to aim for. However, my question specifically pertains to the cases where it would be good to incorporate (say, after the business proves to be feasible).

robyates 14 years ago | | |

I was wondering about what the current policy was myself. I have been debating on studying in the UK and Europe, but ending up choosing to stay the U.S. for the startup resources. Thanks for explaining the new visa policy.

I talked with two guys from Germany and Australia, and both said incorporating in their respective countries was difficult. I'd research either Chile or Israel and see what their policies are.

For the entrepreneur visa, it looks like you must have 200,000 pounds in the bank, so for me that definitely takes the option off the table: http://www.visabureau.com/uk/entrepreneur-visa.aspx Feel free to let me know if you find other ways to do a startup in the UK or Europe. Good luck!

robyates 14 years ago |

Also check out Israel, specifically Tel Aviv: http://www.amazon.com/Start-up-Nation-Israels-Economic-Mirac...

Cilvic 14 years ago |

Berlin, Germany is awesome, very vibrant scene, quite cheap compared to London, not big in bioinformatics though

plam 14 years ago |

Would incorporating a shell company and operating your startup inside a corporate entity be allowable in the UK?

ginger_beer 14 years ago | |

I'm afraid I don't really get this. Would you elaborate more ? Thanks !

robyates 14 years ago |

Try Chile: http://www.startupchile.org/