That time when I accidentally social engineered myself to a film set(nibblestew.blogspot.com) |
That time when I accidentally social engineered myself to a film set(nibblestew.blogspot.com) |
So are most telemarketers (maybe not the "blue collar" part I guess). Doesn't make them not scum.
In LA obviously it's a streamlined process: https://www.filmla.com/for-filmmakers/permits/
As I'm walking all of a sudden I notice that J Lo was a few feet from me with cameras on her, clearly in the middle of a scene they were actively filming. I play it cool and walk into the bodega, where the film monitors were setup and people were watching the live feed. Some guy -- I read him as the DP -- goes "hey nice work, you're background?" to which I respond "oh, no man, I'm just buying something". They shut the whole scene down, because clearly I had no contract and ruined the shot, and as I walk out of the bodega J Lo is just looking at me smiling.
Some PA totally got fired that day.
They loved it and kept the shot, but then realized- whoever this was, she now had a spoken part in the film! They had to find her, get her to join the actors guild, and then pay her some minimum amount for having a line in the film.
I'm sure someone will reply now with the correct version of this story, the woman's name, which Star Trek film it was, and a link to proof of this all.
What the subtext says to me is that the assistant director, or whoever OP talked to, was well aware that OP was just some rando passing through, (probably through experience working in cities), and not a unionized member of SAG. The “nice work” comment was an opportunity for OP to say, ‘uh huh’ and float the director enough plausible deniability to salvage the shot. As soon as he said, “no”, it’s cut and reshoot. Probably not a big deal, but worth a shot (pun intended) from the director.
Film crews are incredibly overworked, underpaid and work in absolutely terrible conditions. Film production is an intricate machine that requires everything to be perfectly in place in order to get a shot and things very frequently go wrong even without random people walking on set and gumming up the works.
Distracting people or touching / moving things can absolutely hold up a shot and bring the entire set to a halt. The result of that is you'll end up keep a very tired crew out for much longer than they need to be. It can also easily cost a production assistant their job.
Film production isn't a secret. You can watch a documentary on it, read about it in forums or even get permission to observe a film shoot where they'll place you safely out of the way. There are much better ways to satisfy this curiosity than just walking onto a set.
So I have it on pretty good authority that you can social engineer any situation with an elderly dog.
I'll usually ask if when I come back in 5 minutes or so if they'll be filming so that I don't disrupt them. Even if I'm super respectful, they usually wind up trying to stop me from getting back to my apartment when I return. It took me a while to figure out that I can just ignore them and keep walking.
Still, it was cool to see Oscar the grouch on my street.
I've walked through a lot of sets, and they really only care about keeping random people out when the cameras are actually rolling. The logistics of filming in a city simply don't work otherwise.
Is the author on HN? He mentions that they only managed to film 2 scenes. Is that right, or was it 2 scenes over and over and over and over and... I guess most action scenes are CGI these days, but when some gunfire+explosion scene is filming outside your office, where they do the same 20 second sequence 100 times, man that gets old real quick.
Years ago I worked IT at a film lab that also did onsite digital capture. There was a photo shoot going on and I needed to go onsite to troubleshoot a computer. The onsite Tech told me the stage number and streets. I said I know where that is and drove off. The location of the studio they were shooting at was across the street from Paramount Studios in Hollywood. I pulled up to the gate and explained to the guard that there was a shoot going on and I needed to get there ASAP to fix a issue that was holding up the shoot. The guard did not question much and let me through. I parked and made my way to sound stage 2 and found the set empty (giant hanger style set). I quickly realized something was off and called the on site Tech where he told me no their location was at a studio across the street. When I finally got to my location I fixed the issue then I got to sit next to the former Miss Israel. I was surprised how easy it was for me to get onto the Paramount Set and how much potential access I would have had.
These signs appear frequently around where I live in London. Occasionally when I am out for a run along one of my usual routes and I see a new set of signs I follow them and end up at the set. I don't make conversation or even actually stop running - I sometimes look over to try to see if there is someone famous I recognise but otherwise I'm not interested in what it is.
I did a bit of background artist/extra work many years ago and know that really the process is deadly dull, but it is nice to add a bit of variety and distraction to my running route.
I don't see them: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jEsNvObIwQg
I believe this is standard procedure on sets to keep from gathering a crowd, or leaking information about the film prior to marketing release. I’m sure there are other good reasons.
Crowds generally just don't form in NYC though. We see shoots all the time.
Coolest one was for The Knick, a turn-of-the-century period piece about a storied hospital, which was filmed on my block the year I moved to NYC (early 2013). There's a beautiful building on the block, the Boys High School in Brooklyn [0], which was used for the hospital exteriors. The Knick is a turn-of-the-century period setting; they covered the entire street in gravel (for weeks), erected gas lamps, etc.
[0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boys_High_School_(Brooklyn)
I don't approve of dishonesty, but I thought that was clever.
Also in Madrid, I was an extra in The Vault [3]. Near the beginning, the main characters meet at a London pub on a rainy evening - filmed in sunny Madrid in summer! I had never seen fake rain on set. I also was within a meter of Liam Cunningham [4] whose Ser Davos was one of my favorite GoT characters :)
[0] http://gabrielgambetta.biz
[1] https://www.imdb.com/title/tt11695350/
[2] https://www.imdb.com/name/nm1336827
You can go far by simply asking to watch and learn, too. Sneakery is only really required where there's "security" that hasn't got enough to do already.
How is this "social engineering"? If I try to beat a yellow light and almost hit another car I wasn't "accidentally stunt driving".
007 over here... hahaha
And of course it doesn't include all the off-set work like Art Department, Production Office, Construction.
And that still doesn't include all the post-production work like Sound, Editing, VFX, and more.
Source: I work in film.
Highly recommend _Under Pressure: Making 'the Abyss'_ it does not do this. It's definitely still rich people talking to really rich people who are now crazy rich people, but, it does not sugar coat things. Very good watch.
Steam is a utility in NYC, from co-generation. It's used to provide heat.
At least when I was younger, steam was also a utility in Boston. I used to see it escape from "Boston Steam" manholes. Not sure if it's still a utility there or not, though.
For example "the dark knight" was Rory's first kiss(rfk) because the director's son had his first kiss (or so I've been told, I've not actually verified that)
Prince Caspian was TOASTIE (or something like that)
I think that casino royal was saville row, but that might have been an internal name
Film crews are large, typically not one continuous unit, ie there’s always new people on set so seeing a new face isn’t uncommon. They’re also extremely busy and overworked so it doesn’t take much at all to blend in. Even if you just happen to be walking by with no intentions of trying to work your way onto a set.
It was a North Shore Long Island town, but the movie was supposed to take place in Indiana (I think). When I watched the movie (somewhat forgettable, IMO), I kept looking for seagulls.
They actually made a façade on most of the buildings downtown. Lotta work.
I have been annoyed by a film crew filming a netflix series for 2 x 5 days this spring around my house and it was fucking annoying. From the screetching tires and the horrible smell of that saab 900 they had chosen for one of the main character while I was on videocalls, to preventing me from actually leave my house and start my motorbike to do some errands and leave cigarette butts in front of my door.
Not a single warning a few days before so I can accomodate nor a compensation for the annoyance. Additionnally it may not be entirely the fault of tge film set but the police would put signs only the night before and tow all cars still parked in the street the next morning. Nice for the people not in town or who simply don't use their car everyday.
My neighbour was out of town, off vacationing with their family. They had a large family with several kids, so they had a good 2 or 3 cars parked around the front of their home.
The film crew had mandated that all cars needed to be cleared from the set. So absolutely no cars on the street. They went around asking people to move all their cars down to the school parking lot a couple blocks away. My neighbours weren't home to hear this or even be notified.
The set director (I think that must be who they were cause they yelled a lot at everyone) was cursing at my neighbour's home, waving hands angrily, and called a tow truck to move all of the neighbour's cars. A person came to ask if we knew where they were or had their contact number. We told them they were out of town.
They did not move the cars back. School re-opened after the long weekend, neighbour got fined for parking tickets down at the school. Came back home to missing vehicles, called the cops, freaked out, eventually found their cars down at the school, had to pay over $500 in parking fines, one of their cars had even been towed down to the impound lot for improper parking on a private space.
It was a gigantic mess. Doubt the film crew cares, they were long gone and probably not even in the country by the time my neighbour was capable of filing a grievance with them.
I have some empathy to the film crew, but while I'm all about practical effects in some ways, the city neighbourhoods should be CGId ASAP. This isn't a tiny-non-issue. Think about all the movies and shows on all the networks on all the streaming services. The 37 seasons of NCIS and 32 seasons of Law & Order and ten million episodes of all the crappy shows - every how many scenes in all of them closing down some neighbourhood somewhere for the shot of actor walking down the street.
However, it's really the city's responsibility to notify everyone, unless otherwise negotiated; when film crews do all that it's generally a courtesy thing. Sometimes the crew wants to do that in advance but the city will ding them for taking the initiative.
Film shoots are a big kickback to the police department. Hiring cops for security is required contractually and it's a sweet assignment because overtime is inevitable. Those jobs go to cops who are close to retirement because pensions are usually calculated as a % of final 2 years' pay. Smart crews also hire or plan their own security because the cops just show up to eat and flirt with the actresses and can't be relied on to watch gear.
Location scouts get paid the big bucks to not only know where to shot but how and to grease all the appropriate wheels.
I live in a turn of the century neighborhood with a lot of craftsman bungalows, four squares, victorians, etc. So there's usually a couple smaller film productions every summer.
They're generally quite considerate. If they're doing an exterior shot they'll only block people going through for the brief moment they're actually filming. They're organized and tidy other than yes there's gonna be a ton of generator cables running around. Knitting seems to be the big hobby for staff waiting for the next shot.
I talked with the owner of the convenience store about this stuff one time. Some production was shooting across the corner and liked the look of his store and wanted to use it as a backdrop for a few things. So they worked out a simple deal where they'd repaint his entire exterior in trade for the rights to film. He was totally happy with the situation and said they didn't really disrupt his business.
I wonder what ends up making the difference?
> If you're thinking about doing like this guy did, please don't.
The author starts by stating:
> The area did not seem to be closed off so obviously I went in to take a closer look.
And
> I was probably there for around 30 minutes or so until someone finally asked me if I was part of the crew and then kindly asked me to leave which I did.
Does one need to go through life like they are stepping on eggshells?
My guess would be that you're interpreting the comment as, "Please don't accidentally wander onto a film set out of ignorance," whereas my interpretation (and perhaps that of those who have voted for it) of the comment was, "Please don't be inspired by this to seek out and actively trespass on a closed film set."
They're two slightly different things.
Why not instead be considerate and respectful for others' work by not ruining it? Road workers don't always have perfect boundaries and yet I hope you don't just go step into their paint while reciting your constitutional rights. This is the same thing without the paint.
But as someone who lives in Los Angeles and sees this all the time — and has many friends who work on sets — you absolutely should not do this. Sets almost always “look like they’re open.” That doesn’t mean they are, it’s because there’s a-million-and-one things being done on the set by _skilled_ people who are being paid near minimum wage, working late, getting yelled at, and skipping meals and still can’t get everything that needs to be done done (Hollywood is lucrative once you get above the ground floor, but those early levels are brutal in every part of the industry).
How would you feel if someone just came and sat next to you working on a PR in a coffee shop and kept asking questions about everything you were doing? Now imagine you were as exhausted as the people on set, and there were dozens of people asking you the same question. Because this happens all the time here in Los Angeles.
Again, totally agree what they do is interesting! But they’re not doing it for you, and they’re in the middle of working.
Do you walk into the middle of a construction site when a crew is working because you’re interested in that process, too?
Is not by itself justification to do a thing.
The degree to which this inconvenienced the locals was quite high, we didn't get any compensation at all for this use of the space that we were already paying for and more than once were unable to leave or enter the building because some hotshot director wanted to do things all over again.
Whether film crews are underpaid and overworked or not is really none of my concern, it is up to them to stand up for their rights and whether they work in terrible conditions or not I can't verify but I can tell you that what they spent on catering in a day probably dwarfs the budget of some African countries to feed thousands of times more people (and don't get me started on the amount of stuff they threw away afterwards).
So if someone accidentally walks on to a set then that's just too bad. Some people have a life and/or a job and that counts as well.
idk. Obviously don't be in other people's way, don't climb fences, don't lie to security, don't "social engineer" your way in, and if someone asks you politely to leave leave. This is in fact what has happened. Once they figured out that he doesn't belong they asked him to leave and he left.
But if it is true what he writes the set was just a public street and he just walked up to them unimpeded. I don't see a problem with that. If it is a problem for the crew they should get fences and security to block people's way.
From the article: All in all if you ever get the chance to observe a film crew in operation I highly recommend it. It is a better "making of" experience than any professionally produced featurette or documentary.
> There are much better ways to satisfy this curiosity than just walking onto a set.
Next time consider putting the set in a private location instead of literally in a public square. Everyone gets the benefit of entering such a public location.
This shouldn't be true but, sadly, it probably is. Many "Making of"-type docs and featurettes used to actually show interesting things about how the film was made. As someone with extensive experience in video and film production, I always found these fascinating. In fact, seeing some of these as a kid strongly influenced the fact I worked in the technical end of production.
However, for at least the past decade, outside of a few trade-specific publications, the vast majority of such docus feature very little that's not obvious about how something was made. These things now focus almost exclusively on celebrity actors because they have the broadest appeal to the mass market public and such docus are funded by the distributing studio's marketing dept.
The rare exceptions are some massive-budget, effects heavy, blockbusters which already have huge fandoms where the marketers have enough budget and perceived interest to fund the creation of real behind-the-scenes, making-of content. A good example is some of content released around The Lord of the Rings trilogy which actually focused on individual aspects of production not directly involving the actors.
As someone with a lot of production experience, I should add that I disagree with the idea that "just walking onto a set and watching" is a good way to learn anything - or even very interesting. I have a tween who was fascinated by movie production, until I actually took her to some movie sets where she got to experience just how slow and boring the process can be to watch. Hours of rigging, lighting and camera tests for two minutes of shooting, which you often can't clearly see from most places on the set other than directly behind the camera, and it's rare to be able to hear any significant dialog unless you're almost in the shot. Frankly, even I find visiting a set as an observer pretty boring (other than seeing old co-workers and friends), and I actually understand and like the arcane technical aspects of production like lens focal lengths, color temps, etc. I'd much rather watch a well-produced, insightful docu which shows the gear and setups being used edited together with through-the-camera results and narrated by the technical crew when they aren't busy actually working. Unfortunately, that kind of content is all-too-rare these days and most featurettes called "Making-of..." are 90% celebrity actor/director interviews focused on the marketing team's talking points about the film slapped over a little behind-the-scenes B-roll.
People get into the arts by choice, nobody chooses to work in films because they're starving. It's weird to feel sorry for people who get to do their dream jobs.
> Film production is an intricate machine that requires everything to be perfectly in place in order to get a shot and things very frequently go wrong even without random people walking on set and gumming up the works.
I've been on filmsets and have the opposite impression. While they have a script that describes the set, most of it is actually improvised. As long as you don't get into the shot, or disrupt people doing work, you are not affecting the production.
I have heard endless complaints from fellow devs about being overworked and burnt out.
I think it’s okay to point out when conditions are rough even if you’re getting paid to do the thing you wanted to do.
The author responded:
> In case it was not obvious from the text, I did not do either of these things. No-one else should either.
I don't know why but for some reason, more people feel like they need to be the main character in an adventure. Maybe it's TikTok or who knows what. Either way, I'm sure if some rando walked into their life and started messing with their work, they'd be quite miffed.
I live in NYC and I see film crews all the time. I love the fact that it happens here because it's one of those things that makes NYC so neat. But it's like the zoo. You're encouraged to watch from a distance but please don't jump into the animal's enclosure.
If you want to really fit in, have an old walkie talkie on your belt and an ear piece (surveillance).
Some film sets with union folks can get very particular about who touches what. But maybe the things you'd help carry wouldn't fall under the responsibility of said union folks.
Also, if a film set has had a robbery or theft, and the crew has worked with each other long enough to know who the regular day players are, you'd stick out like a sore thumb.
But all these types of chicanery will come with such risks, I suppose.
Best play it safe and pretend to be handing out coffees and snacks (or actually do it you're feeling kind)
I’m in team ask-before-picking-up-other-peoples-stuff, but maybe that works for some.
They definitely didn't want to have to call 'cut' in that moment -- you've already set up the shot and have J Lo (and I think Ray Liotta) doing their thing. Starting over isn't ideal (but probably not a huge deal).
Now I'll be on the lookout =)
“But Mr. Dent, the plans have been available in the local planning office for the last nine months.”
“Oh yes, well, as soon as I heard I went straight round to see them, yesterday afternoon. You hadn’t exactly gone out of your way to call attention to them, had you? I mean, like actually telling anybody or anything.”
“But the plans were on display . . .”
“On display? I eventually had to go down to the cellar to find them.”
“That’s the display department.”
“With a flashlight.”
“Ah, well, the lights had probably gone.”
“So had the stairs.”
“But look, you found the notice, didn’t you?”
“Yes,” said Arthur, “yes I did. It was on display in the bottom of a locked filing cabinet stuck in a disused lavatory with a sign on the door saying ‘Beware of the Leopard.’”
I completely agree. Reading the title, and then reading the article, I was quite underwhelmed.
You got that backwards. It's the film crew that got lucky, since they apparently didn't provide any indication that he shouldn't be in a place he is otherwise allowed to be.
Is this really common? If so, I'm glad we have rules here that say otherwise. If you want a permit to close a street in my city, it's your responsibility to notify residents and businesses affected. If you don't, the city might not issue it. And even if they do, if a car is in your way because you didn't notify folks in advance, the police will happily stand around to watch what happens. Here, our tax dollars go toward using the roads, not closing them. You pay for notices, you pay for the barricades, you pay for the guards. You even pay for the police, standing around, laughing at you for failing to follow through on your obligation.
I know for a fact that we subsidize film production into our city. Us tax payers literally pay money to the film companies to subsidize their costs. They do not pay us or our city. The idea is that this would promote more use of local businesses. It does not usually work out that way though.
A bunch of investigative reporting has been done in our local news that indicates that the majority of the companies filming here do not even hire local businesses, even going as far as to have their food frozen and flown in with their gear because they can treat it as a subsidized cost.
In short, they frequently do not help our community, they actively tie up our streets, don't employ local businesses, and exploit our tax system to make a profit on their shoots. Never underestimate corporate greed and its ability to subvert tax laws for their own gain.
To make matters worse, from the folks I know who run local film, recording, catering, etc, they indicate that they have to aggressively cut their prices down and make almost no profit because the corporations hiring them are unscrupulous in negotiation. If they don't cave to their demands, they corporation walks away and brings in their own stuff from outside the province/Canada and writes it off as further subsidized costs.
My old neighborhood in Brooklyn always had filming, and my current town is on its third movie shot on main st so far this year - I wonder if those are usually subsidized too.
Great Youtube video on this topic, especially since you're likely talking about Vancouver: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ojm74VGsZBU
Construction sites are often on private property and in any case have clearly marked boundaries, though. I don't think it's unreasonable for people doing work in a public space to expect and handle a certain amount of polite curiosity from the public.
I meant that even in a public space for construction, however, spectators usually aren't allowed to wander into the middle of active construction, bumping shoulders with the workers. Staying off to the side is fine – as is also normal when watching a set in action! It's just the folks that get in the middle of a site who have no business being there (or worse, try to pretend to be an authorized background extra and ruin a shot because they have no idea where they're supposed to stand) that disrupt things.
But the rest of the story requires reading: https://legendsrevealed.com/entertainment/2016/02/25/did-a-w...
Anyone know why this is? Why a person uttering a line must be part of a guild? Is this a U.S. thing, or international?
Also, why aren't the talks of unions here on HN using the world guild? Union? Meh. Guild? Yeah! Developers would flock to be part of a Developers Guild.
Edit: Answer to first questions:
https://www.quora.com/Are-all-actors-and-actresses-part-of-t...
>SAG-AFTRA is a USA union. There are many many hundreds of thousands of actors in other countries around the world. Other countries have unions too. Some, like SAG-AFTRA are strong and look out for actors’ interests very well. They may also act as gatekeepers and insist that their members have a certain standard and professionalism. There are plenty of countries where unions have little strength and actors are bullied and have next to no bargaining power. American actors have a lot to be thankful for.
Because the guild has an agreement with the studio that only guild members can have speaking roles.
Joining the guild is pretty straight-forward. It's a lot less work than the typical whiteboard interview.
If you are going out of town for longer than that amount of time, you either need to find somewhere you can pay to park your car, or you need to get a neighbor or friend to check in on it periodically and move it if there's a sign.
This responsibility is the only cost of using public space to store your car, aside from a nominal annual vehicle registration fee. Seems fair to me.
I don't think it would work in most situations. Construction site? Sure. Sporting event? Probably.
But in most of the places a person might try to go, I personally would avoid a high-vis vest at all costs.
I wasn't management, I was just new on site and had come from a planning meeting, and I was pretty sure the next guy I needed to meet was in the belly of the plant in a location I only had the vaguest idea of, but I knew it was gonna be a long walk.
I ended up walking the length of the place twice (almost a mile) before I decided I'd had enough sightseeing (but what sightseeing it was!) and and actually asked someone, who made a wisecrack about how he helps so many visiting managers in this joint they should make him a manager himself! I decided against correcting him.
Over the coming weeks at that plant, I wore a T-shirt and older hi-viz if I wanted to blend in as a worker, or a button-down shirt and the crisp hi-viz if I wanted to wander. As long as I kept abreast of my assigned duties, nobody sweated the details, and it was better than any museum of science and industry I've ever paid to get into. Had a few more folks make gentle cracks about how I must be a manager of some other group over to see what this group does, I'd ask a few questions and be on my way.
Likewise for jobsites and urbex, I have a hard-hat covered in stickers, and one that's so pristine I keep it in a pillowcase. Perceived wear is an important component of The Look™.
some time ago i couchsurfed with the owner or manager of a steel processing plant. he gave me a tour. one of the most memorable experiences.
Corporations aren't the only ones making movies, btw. And the whole "but my rights" talk when it's about a person who could've just taken a different street makes me laugh, nothing else. Is that really how you think about your day to day life, or is it just a post-facto rationalization?
Perhaps your ability to detect and understand context is simply vastly superior to mine.
That said, they'll often just let you wander across as long as you're not wearing distracting clothing.
Is it enforced? No. But technically, it's there.
Very much enforced in NYC - where they do around $600 million a year in parking tickets.
The vast majority of them are likely the ones that can be verified on the spot -- things like being parked in a no parking zone (whether street cleaning or regular), expired or hasn't paid parking, etc.
In California we have the same law, and it is certainly enforced, usually at the behest of nosy neighbors who have nothing else to do.
To verify, they usually have to mark your tires to check you haven't moved the car in the 72 hours (you could've just parked in the same place), so it usually requires two outcalls to even issue a ticket. That's a lot of work when you're anywhere outside of the downtown core where that initial call could be done as part of other work.
Even in the event of a street closure, I expect that a car parked on my own driveway is fine. And since I'm not using public space to store it, your "public space to store your car" comment is not applicable.
I understand how that happened, but wow. I hope that the filming crew was forced to pay for this.
A lot of cities require that the city tows the car, rather than the filming crew. Exactly to avoid this kind of problem.
Film crew moved all of their cars off of their own property down to the school.
Once school opened up, they were now “improperly parked” (by the film crew) and fines were issued and one of the cars was impounded.
NYC has alternate side of the street parking on most streets which means that for a two hour period, typically midday, on Mon/Thu or Tue/Fri. This has the effect of making you move your car every 72 hours, and it is trivially enforceable. Additionally there are 1 & 2 hour spots which are typically metered.