Ask HN: How to best learn a new (spoken) language

6 points by jamiedumont 1 year ago | 9 comments

So … what does the consensus on best technique for learning a new language?

I remember seeing some techniques mentioned here over the years - specifically in response to a question about DuoLingo where the conclusion was there are better methods.

I’m a native English speaker, who at points has had conversational French under my belt and GCSE (high school?) equivalent education in French and German.

I’m looking to pick up enough German over the next 12 months to make better-than-average/expected conversation whilst on holiday in Austria.

So, what’s the best methods to (re)learn a language?

locallost 1 year ago |

Even though the ability to learn a language decreases in adulthood, I'd say the immersion part is unavoidable. I learned English as a child and teenager, and took a big leap when I first went online and read and read and constantly read. German I learned, or started, in my mid twenties and I'm fairly good, but without living in Germany for over a decade now it wouldn't have worked as well. If you need to process it as you speak it will not really flow. How to achieve immersion without living in a country? I don't know.

As a comparison, I learned a bit of Italian for a vacation with Duolingo and I'll say it helps, but the moment I stopped after the vacation, it was basically all gone. I did not create a meaningful lasting impression in my mind. It would've been better to try to listen to Italian im parallel through movies etc. Still, my son learns French with Duolingo and I noticed it helps him focus on doing the work, I even have a feeling it's improving his overall learning in school.

Another caveat is that the way they speak in Austria or parts of it can be challenging for non native speakers, and even some native speakers.

Alex-Programs 1 year ago |

r/languagelearning and r/german have some good advice in their wikis.

You'll find a lot of people encouraging comprehensible input, where you try to receive as much German as possible while understanding about ~90% of it and letting your brain kinda "work it out" the "natural" way.

It's quite cool, and I've made a tool built around it (https://nuenki.app, which selectively translates websites to give you comprehensible input as you browse the web). I'd recommend pairing it with other methods - Anki is effective but miserable, and proper grammar reading (the subreddit has some good links) can have a very high ROI.

I quite like the Easy German youtube channel. They have some clips from Austrians - and that's something to bear in mind, as Austrian German and Swiss German are quite different to the High German ("Hochdeutsch") (edit: see the reply; I'm wrong here) you'll generally be taught.

E.g. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vzv_FDh4N2o

jamiedumont 1 year ago | |

My German peaked during an exchange, where after a few weeks of it "washing over" me I was using the language more naturally, even if still making frequent errors. Equally my French peaked when I was working around lots of French tourists, so I'm very onboard with this exposure-based approach.

Nuenki is pretty much what I was looking for - plus it's a good shove to make switch from Safari to Firefox (a change I've been meaning to make).

I've heard of Anki as a learning tool, but not tried it. What makes it miserable?

I'll be sure to checkout the Reddit and YouTube links too. Thanks for the help internet stranger!

Alex-Programs 1 year ago | | |

> I've heard of Anki as a learning tool, but not tried it. What makes it miserable?

I'm a bit biased here. I used it prolifically for years in order to optimise my learning (school, not languages) so that I could compensate for a concussion. I heavily burnt out of it and I've not touched it since.

Nevertheless, if I were to say something more objective, it's that it's very dull. Other learning methods have you going over either somewhat-engaging content or intellectually stimulating learning (e.g. reading about the complexities of grammar).

Anki is just... word. think. click. feedback. repeat. repeat. repeat 200 times. repeat tomorrow.

You can do the whole thing with the space bar and 1-4 on your keyboard.

You can make yourself do that, but be wary of it souring you on the language or burning out.

> Nuenki is pretty much what I was looking for - plus it's a good shove to make switch from Safari to Firefox

I hope you like it! Let me know if you have any feedback etc.

I'd like to add Safari support, but Apple makes it pretty difficult to publish as someone who doesn't have a Mac or lots of money to spend.

Good luck with your German!

kaaskop 1 year ago | |

Small nitpick from an Austrian - Austrian German is Hochdeutsch, it's a pluricentric language with three distinct centers - Austrian, Swiss and German German are equally valid versions of Hochdeutsch.

That being said, German also has hundreds of distinct dialects - from Viennese to Platt.

Alex-Programs 1 year ago | | |

I didn't know that! Thank you. I've always heard "Hochdeutsch" used to describe the "standard form" (based on German German) online. I stand corrected.

jamager 1 year ago |

Very very summarized (the devil is in the details):

From 0: phrase books + spaced repetition + easy recordings for beginners (many webs provide them for lots of languages). Don't forget to work on listening and pronunciation

A1 - A2: add active reading with graded readers + some writing

B1 – B2: keep on graded readers and SRS, add Italki tutor, podcasts and new learning materials. Mix passive and active reading / listening. Start looking at grammar

+B2: lots of comprehensive input + whatever you fancy (eg language exchanges, creative writing, etc)

If you want to know more I wrote a book here: https://thehardway.guide/ (with lots of links to other books / sources)

baxtr 1 year ago |

Just out of curiosity: anyone here from the States that is seriously considering moving to Europe/Germany due to the political situation in the US?

gus_massa 1 year ago |

One possibility is to watch movies with subtitles, bu increasing he difficulty with time:

German sound + English subtitles

German sound + German subtitles

German sound + no subtitles

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If you can get them, some cartons like Dora the Explorer or Pepa Pig have a very slow pace and may be helpful.