Who People Talk to When They're Struggling(graphsaboutreligion.com) |
Who People Talk to When They're Struggling(graphsaboutreligion.com) |
Seems like a pretty broken premise, ranking comfort instead of what you expected to help most. Also related, people are typically more comfortable confessing to strangers or under circumstances that won't endanger an existing relationship, which seems like a big part of why confession is anonymous. Self-reporting here is probably basically the same as asking "according to your community norms, how are you supposed to answer a question like this?" without much real reveal
But don't we, in real times, turn to the people we're comfortable talking to? We are not machines ranking the effectiveness of our peers for best outcome, though some of us surely still weigh that! It would be nice to go the most effective route, but sometimes that brings a lot of pain, judgement, or unforseen externalities.
(and hopefully we pick our close social relationships to make us more effective too!)
> "according to your community norms ..." ... without much real reveal
It puts data to what our understanding of those norms are. I don't know if there's a bigger reveal than "yeah, people generally are pretty comfortable with their spouse"
Tbh I was surprised anyone would/could open up and have an emotional conversation with a neighbor (when looking at risk vs reward). But, there are a lot of types of neighbors too.
How much does the author owe you? My guess is zero.
If he didn't measure what you wanted to be measured ... that's your problem.
Do you go home and talk to your spouse? Do you go to church and talk with your pastor? Do you go to your therapist or to the local bar?
> Comfort with mental health care has become another facet of political sorting in the U.S.
I'm skeptical. Bars and churches and friends are way cheaper and more accessible in red states. It's hard enough to get poorer, less educated men comfortable going to the doctor, let alone a therapist.
Also missing from this perspective. What do people who are not from western countries do?
Pew Research: Americans are less likely than others around the world to feel close to people in their country or community - https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2024/05/08/americans... - May 8th, 2024
> Differences by religion also emerge. Religiously unaffiliated Americans are much less likely than those who are religiously affiliated to feel connected to others in their local community (43% vs. 60%). This pattern aligns with previous research on interpersonal connectedness and philanthropy among religious people. Religious people tend to be more likely than nonreligious people to volunteer and give to charity – though they prefer these activities benefit others within their own religious groups. [My note: Religion->Shared belief tribalism, observation, not intended to be derogatory]
Pew Research: Connectedness to community, country and the world - https://www.pewresearch.org/global/2023/12/06/connectedness-... - December 6th, 2023
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bowling_Alone
> Bowling Alone: The Collapse and Revival of American Community is a 2000 nonfiction book by Robert D. Putnam. It was developed from his 1995 essay entitled "Bowling Alone: America's Declining Social Capital" in the Journal of Democracy. Putnam surveys the decline of social capital in the United States since 1950. He has described the reduction in all the forms of in-person social intercourse upon which Americans used to found, educate, and enrich the fabric of their social lives. He argues that this undermines the active civic engagement which a strong democracy requires from its citizens.
Just as a curiosity, as I don't have any experience of red states myself, how easy would it be for a closet homosexual to come out and get support from their bar, churches and friends in a red state, typically?
For example, my small town in a red state was not accepting of homosexuality in general, but my church was tolerant, and my church youth group was affirming and supportive.
What are your struggles? (single item or a long list)
Talk to one of these:
Close Friends
Spouse/Partner
Immediate Family Member
Mental Health Therapist
A Co-Worker
Neighbor
Religious/Spiritual Leader
"I can't pay my mortgage because I lost my job"
That's a real problem. Solution: Who will pay that mortgage? For how long?
My church, friends, possibly in-laws would pay my mortgage for about 3-6 months but after that the help runs out because the REAL problem is those 3-6 months of not looking hard enough, not taking any job, not down sizing, not moving into someone's garage, not spending beyond the budget.
And conversely, neither priest nor friend will be able to deal with actual mental health issue you have.
Is it that or is it the cost and availability?
Society was trying actually to meet this need in so many other pseudo forms, but where it fell short and what I needed was:
- a safe space to share what my experience without needing to be fixed or someone giving me unsolicited feedback
- place where competition was turned off (sports groups, board game nights, video games etc had previously been this but since they were competitive they met a different need)
- a cadence that met regularly and where space for me to speak with structure was a requirement
I liked this so much I even formed one in DC before I was pushed away for work to an abusive Dallas Capital One environment (which my men helped me navigate while my coworkers accepted the abuse being blind to it). I Highly recommend trying a mens groups, find one on Facebook or Google, or try the project mankind groups or No Mr Nice Guy’s Dr Glover runs one online. The one I was a part of longest is also open: embodied masculine (more extreme embodiment based group) but starting off get your toes wet first.
For example - this one about generations and trust was surprising to me: https://www.graphsaboutreligion.com/p/gen-z-doesnt-trust-any...
or this on perception of the religiosity of holidays: https://www.graphsaboutreligion.com/p/is-christmas-a-religio...
It's a pity because I found freemasonry to be hugely beneficial in terms of friendship, interesting discussions and support.
I recently went thru a rough period triggered by how my spouse was feeling. If you've both always counted on having the other ready to listen, and that's temporarily impossible for acute reasons, the shock is enormous, and almost undermined my problem solving ability to understand I needed to find a psychologist to talk to.
We're ok now, but it could have easily gotten way worse before it got better. Having a solid relationship is unfortunately not a protection from losing the security it gives you, psychologically.
People need connection, but the varieties of connection are vast. What works for one person, can be terrible for another. Maybe talking to bots gives you what you need, which is great for you. But projecting your solution to everyone else is not a rational step to take.
So, men's groups don't solve the problem of the lack of healthy regular socializing with 2-3 good friends, which for men in many countries has fallen off a cliff since the smartphone and Covid.
If you want regular socializing with 2-3 good friends though, I think the friends made from a men's group would be closer to what you are seeking than from a random hobby-based group.
edit: in re to "even without competition a pecking order gets established" my experience has shown this to be oversimplifying it. The "pecking order" in a mens group is way different from a different group. the pecking order in men's groups with a structur-based leader, is that the leader gets the "alpha" status if there was one and if they are a good leader they aren't there to abuse that privilege. But since they should be providing it professionally (paid service) it isn't mixed with friendship as much. At least the "pecking order" there is oriented around serving you rather than random socialization without that purpose.
One thing about UU's is that it's not dogma based. There's nothing you have to believe to be a UU. Instead, it's covenant based. You are in the community when you adhere to the agreements of the community. These are usually things like mutual respect, deep listening, etc.
> This post has been unlocked through a generous grant from the Lilly Endowment for the Association of Religion Data Archives (ARDA). The graphs you see here use data that is publicly available for download and analysis through link(s) provided in the text below.
Code for this post can be found at https://gist.github.com/ryanburge/0895d855fdc93c3ce26b034349...
(Ryan also wrote "The Vanishing Church: How the Hollowing Out of Moderate Congregations Is Hurting Democracy, Faith, and Us," which I highly recommend; he is exceptionally data driven within this domain, no affiliation besides subscribing to his Substack)
https://bakerpublishinggroup.com/products/9781587436697_the-...
[0] https://publica.org.au/wp-content/uploads/DiJulio-et-al.-Lon...
[1] https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamanetworkopen/fullarticle...
Once the floor drops out from under you there is nothing to stop the rapid decent to nothingness. There is a generation of discarded people who have nobody left. When we lose our last threads of social connection there's no way back. Beyond hopeless.
Enjoy your bubble. america is completely fucked.
Being in your shoes in a suburban setting surrounded by families and neat little houses (or huge fields in a country setting) I imagine is hard. I'm only making assumptions.
Have you thought about traveling long weekends or abroad longer? Perfectly doable solo.
Look, I'm not saying it's easy. And when you're in despair, the despair makes it harder. But "impossible" and "beyond hopeless" are lies. Stop believing them. Start trying to find ways to build new relationships, even if it's slow and hard.
My personal preference is a local church but there are other options out there. Club's around a shared interest you have. Community center events in your area. It's won't be quick and it won't be easy but you can reverse this.
Sorry for you situation and stay strong.
It is not hopeless. You state it yourself - there are many people like you, so maybe try and connect with them?
Go to bookclubs.com and start a book club, or join a book club, or go to a local library and do any of the social stuff. Go to a crochet club, even empty-handed, chances are the fiber arts people will have plenty to spare. These are friendships that have to be forged and worked on day in and day out to strengthen them, like a sword.
As a therapist, I focus more on building rapport and establishing connection before diving into the mental health aspects. Without trust/rapport, nothing will move forward in treatment. To generalize is not the best way to put things forward.
For more specialized hobby meetups, it is a common complaint that one's fellows are only met while practicing the hobby, they never become general friends that one can meet regularly with, let alone turn to in emotionally heavy times.
I wouldn't recommend solo travel as a way to socialize unless one knows the person's age. It's a sad fact that over the age of about 30-35, solo travelers (especially men) can no longer take advantage of the social opportunities of the backpacker scene; you might get a few nice chats, but most travelers will be very wary of you.
> Learning how to develop a social network independently is a skill. If your partner leaving you collapses your social life, do you live in a small town where the narrative has turned against you, or did you simply rely on them to be the adult in the room and set up playdates for you like you're a child?
Oh fuck your attitude and grow some empathy. Someone confesses a serious personal problem and you start lecturing them, implying they are incompetent and/or are a man-child?
Some of your advice isn't bad, but your delivery is terrible, and life is more complicated than you imply (e.g. what if he's depressed, what if his partner was controlling and didn't allow him to have an independent social life, what if he has no interest in "fiber arts", etc)?
When there is no one to care
There is someone who gives a f*ck
Who can tell you: life is very fair
It is all cause and effect
Have you even tried?
You can make your own life erect
And I’m sorry the soothsayers lied
But I care, believe me it’s true
You child, you fool
Surely the social clubs are not that few
It’s a skill just like shearing wool